MAY 12, 2004

3:00 P.M.



MEMBERS PRESENT:†††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† Phillip H. Baxter, President

††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† Carl Jay Conner, Vice-President

††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† Don Williams, Secretary

††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† Karan Barnhill, Surveyor

††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† Rod Madden, Deputy Surveyor

††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† Don Ashley, Attorney for the Board



ALSO PRESENT:†††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† Frank Farney, Ray Oeth, Rita McConnell,

††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† Duane E. Erwin, Dianne Gates, Andy Easley.





President Baxter brought the meeting of May 12, 2004 to order.††††††††††




President Baxter stated the first order of business was the approval of minutes from the meetings of April 14, 2004 and April 28, 2004.


Commissioner Williams made a motion to approve both sets of minutes from April 14 and April 28, 2004, 2nd by Commissioner Conner. Motion carried 3-0.






The quotes were passed to Don Ashley, Attorney to open and he read each quote as was presented:


1.      Bigge Excavating††††† ----------------††† $2,543.31

2.      D-Lite Excavating†††† ----------------††† $8,240.00

3.      Triple M Excavating---------------†††† $2,900.00

4.      Ryanís Excavating†††† ---------------†††† $5,580.00



Commissioner Williams asked if all were present for the pre-bid meeting?


Rod Madden, Deputy Surveyor answered that all were present with the exception of Sam Mehringer from Triple M Excavating.


President Baxter asked for any other discussion on this project? There was none.


Commissioner Conner made a motion to accept the bid from Bigge Excavating on Johnson Ditch in the amount of $2,543.31, 2nd by Commissioner Williams. Motion carried 3-0.






Karan stated that this subdivision was continued from a month ago in order to give herself and the Board members a chance to inspect the ditch that runs through the development. She added that she did visit the site and her recommendation to have the Town of Elberfeld improve the ditch through the development by removing the trees and debris that is blocking the channel. She further stated that they should slope the banks to add more capacity and when that portion is done, then the Drainage Board could do improvements to Bluegrass Creek, which is a regulated drain. Karan stated that it probably would not solve the problem but it would assist to alleviate some of the problems that do exist in that area.


Karan explained that she had spoken with Duane Erwin with the Town of Elberfeld and he has indicated that the Town of Elberfeld would be ok with that proposal of cleaning the ditch. She added that her recommendation would be that the Town of Elberfeld do improvements to the ditch, such as slope the banks back to a 3:1 to give it more capacity, removing the trees and blockages in the channel and then in conjunction with that the County Drainage Board and Surveyor would go out and do improvements to Bluegrass Creek, a tributary where all of this drains into. She further added that this would give the ditch more capacity along with a straight shot so that the water would drain quicker and there may also have to be improvements made to roadside ditches as well and to the bridge where it crosses under the road.


Commissioner Conner stated that he had promised Mr. Oeth that he would come out and take a look at the entire ditch, he apologized as he did not make it so he would like to table this issue until the next meeting so that he would have an opportunity to meet with Mr. Oeth and look at this problem. He added that what Karan stated is probably true but maybe there are a few other things that he could suggest also and he also may not agree with how it is to be funded. He stated he is concerned about the city of Elberfeldís agreement to absorb the costs even though they are willing to do it.


Commissioner Conner made a motion to table this issue until next months Drainage Board Meeting.


Commissioner Williams asked why next month?


Commissioner Conner stated that he meant next meeting which will be two weeks from now and asked Commissioner Williams if he would like to accompany him?


Commissioner Williams answered that he would.


Someone from the audience (possibly Mr. Oeth) stated that if you are going to keep building and covering more up with rock and roofs and things like that you had better consider where all that drain comes down through there putting in a retention pond to hold some of that drainage when there are heavy rains.


Karan said in answer to that, the lots that drain to that ditch are all large lots, three acres or more, the smaller lots drain in a different direction. She explained that is why her first reaction was that no retention was needed, but in looking at the area she has considered a retention pond in conjunction with the drainage that is going to the ditch.


The gentleman stated††† that the storm water all drains to the north and there are only a couple of spots where it goes into the creek.


Karan answered that is when the check dam came up and Andy Easley designed it in the ditch for his retention.


The gentleman stated that they were only talking on the one side where most of the water is going to come down right behind the big buildings and it is lower there, so it wouldnít be good for anything else except for a retention pond.


Karan stated that is what they may end up doing, she is just trying to get improvements on the ditch because at the last meeting he was talking about all the curves in the ditch and we are also trying to address that issue.


The gentleman stated that he did not see how they could prove anything until something is done and the County says that they are going to clean out this ditch, but the creek has been there for the last 40 years and they have went all this time without maintaining it. He added that if you give them another 10 years to decide to go in and do something he does not think that is satisfactory. He further stated that it has to be done now, not whenever there is money to do it or when the Town decides to do it, they need to be forced to do it.


Mr. Frank Farney introduced himself to the Board and he stated that he owns the old Chumley turkey farm and he stated he put up a levee along 7 Hills Road because the water came out of the ditch on the North, ran across the road and across his farm land. He stated that he thinks Bluegrass Creek needs to be cleaned as it is bigger on one end than the other and also there are two other tributaries that drain into it and what he would like to see is so many feet of it cleaned every year or at least get started on it.


Karan answered that it could be put on the list as that is part of the work that she was saying could be done in conjunction with the work that was done proposed in the development.


Mr. Farney stated that he has lived there since 1984 and nothing has been done to the ditch in that time. He added that it needs to be straightened out and cleaned up.


President Baxter stated there was a motion on the floor to table this Drainage Plan until the next meeting, 2nd by Commissioner Williams. Motion carried 3-0.


It was stated that everyone who is interested should meet at Mr. Oethís residence Tuesday at approximately 9:00 a.m.




Karan explained that she was not at the last meeting but since the last meeting she has received a report from the design engineer, Bill Bivins with ACCU Land Surveyor that gives the existing condition run-off versus the proposed condition run-off with the grass, roof-tops and etc. and it is certified that the run-off of the proposed conditions will actually be less than the existing conditions which is what she originally thought.


Karan added that it does meet all of the requirements and the Drainage Board does not require retention for developments that are 2 Ĺ acres or more and actually they never have.

She further stated that the County will be looking at Coles Creek for improvements in the near future. She recommends approval of the development.


President Baxter asked if there were any questions from the Board or any remonstrators in the audience?


Cheryl Diane Gates introduced herself and stated that she owned property across Pigeon Valley Road from the proposed subdivision. She stated that at the last meeting they were talking about the proposed run-off and her question is that there are several lots for sale and if they are not sold soon for the owners to sow grass seed or if the owners donít sow all of their acreage as some of them are about 4 acres what about the run-off then? She asked whose responsibility is it until all of this land is seeded or until all of the lots are purchased or if there is an issue with high water and flooding? She also asked if the people who are going to purchase these lots are going to be made aware of the possible problem with flooding or will they just purchase the land and have to live with it? She stated that she doesnít understand how it can be assumed that this development is going to make it all better when it will all be grass, when it may be awhile before it is all grass.


Karan answered that they canít be expected to correct a drainage problem that already exists that they have no control over. She stated that she guesses the answer to her question is that the existing conditions as they are, will stay as they are, but as they build they are not going to get any worse as the lots will be improved with the buildings and grass. She added that if added problems arise besides what is already there, the developer would be responsible for as long as he owns the property, but the County canít make him correct a problem that exists unless it is a problem that exists directly on his property.


Mrs. Gates asked what will the developer be required to do as far as taking care of that property, does it just grow up in weeds or will there be a responsibility to him of some nature?


Karan answered that she does not know of a County ordinance that requires certain maintenance of a lot, but she assumes that if there becomes a hazard where it is causing a problem to the adjoining landowners or zoning laws are broken there would be a civil suit the landowners could file against the developer or landowner. She asked Don Ashley if this was correct?


Mr. Ashley answered that he assumed it would continue the present use while it is being developed?


The developer or owner answered yes or they might also put it to pasture, he added that he believes that it is required to be seeded.


Mrs. Gates stated she had one more question as she had asked this in the Area Plan Commission, what type of homes are to be built, will there be any restrictions? She stated she was told that they have to give a list of restrictions, but she was also told that once it is approved they donít have to stand by those restrictions and she thinks that is confusing, as why have restrictions if they arenít going to be upheld. She asked if she had to attend the Area Plan Commission Meeting to find out what type of home can be built?


Karan answered that would probably be the place to asked as their attorney can answer that question and address their statutes based on the zoning.


Mrs. Gates asked that at the last meeting 2 of the Board Members had said they were going to visit the area behind the McConnells and she wanted to know if they did this?


President Baxter answered yes they did.


Mrs. Gates asked then the Board is satisfied that nothing needs to be done there?


President Baxter answered that he did not think this development would make things any worse. He added that the ditch that runs there is on private property and the County canít control that.


Rita McConnell addressed the Board and introduced herself. She stated that as the Members could see when they visited the site, there is a part of their property that runs low in the back and the Board is saying that while the area is being developed if there is more of a run-off and ground erosion, that they should go to the developer, but what if he has already sold the land where the water is coming from?


Karan answered that there is soil erosion requirements that they have to meet and they also have to file a soil erosion plan with IDEM and DNR which is enforceable through the soil conservation service. She added that if anyone gets erosion problems from a site they should contact Amy Steeples at the Soil Conservation Service. She further added that all developments have to meet certain requirements that adjoining landowners do not receive any run-off from developments.


Commissioner Conner made a motion to approve the Willow Creek Subdivision drainage plan as submitted, 2nd by Commissioner Williams. Motion carried 3-0.





Karan stated that the top sheet that is being handed out is the repair sheet on the Bronco in the last 5-6 months with the exception of the tires and the second sheet is the estimate from Skeltons garage for repairs to the truck and this is the immediate repairs. She stated that this does not address the fact that the truck will not start when it rains and they say they cannot address that issue until it doesnít start and he can look at it then. She added that usually by the time they get there to look at it or we have it towed in, then it starts.


Commissioner Conner asked where the bid prices were on the new truck?


Karan answered that she did not bring them with her, but she could run down to her office and get them. (She left to get them from Roger)


Karan stated that the low bid at $21,515.00 came from Coburn Ford.


Commissioner Conner asked what year was the Bronco?


Karan answered that it was a 1994.


Commissioner Conner asked if she knew what the longevity of the truck would be with the repairs that were going to be done on it?


Karan answered that she did not ask them.


President Baxter stated he thinks that would be hard for anyone to determine that.


Karan stated that the issue of the truck not starting when it gets wet is going to have to be addressed and no one seems to be able to even give her an estimate because they all say they donít know why it is not starting when it gets wet.


Commissioner Williams stated he did not think that would be too difficult of a problem to figure out, he guessed it is probably a rotor or distributor.


President Baxter asked for any other discussion on this matter?


Commissioner Williams stated that he thinks the truck ought to be fixed. He also stated that he hasnít had a chance to ride in it as yet.

Rod Madden told Commissioner Williams any time he wanted to take a ride to call him.


Commissioner Williams told Rod he had a ditch that he wanted Rod to look at?


President Baxter asked if Commissioner Williams wanted to table this discussion until the next meeting?


Commissioner Williams answered no, he has already made a motion to get the Bronco fixed. This motion was 2nd by Commissioner Conner. Motion carried 2-1 Commissioner Baxter opposed.


Commissioner Conner stated that he would like to make a comment in that he thinks that the Board did the right thing by going out and getting 3 bids and he wants to commend Karan or her staff for doing that. He stated that he noticed that all three bids came fromWarrick County vendors. He further stated that when the truck was purchased for the Surveyors office before that they had bids from out of the County also and they saved substantially from going out of the County and added that in the future he thinks that the County ought to use other vendors other than just the ones in Warrick County. He also added that he knows there are people opposed to them doing that but he is not opposed because in his opinion every tax payer in the County benefits because of the savings. He stated that if the County does not save because they do not go out of the County then he does not feel that they are doing their job for the best interest of the majority of the taxpayers.




President Baxter stated there were claims in the amount of $23,469.99. Commissioner Williams made a motion to pay claims, 2nd by Commissioner Conner. Motion passes 3-0.


President Baxter asked if there was any other business to come before this meeting.


Commissioner Williams made a motion to adjourn, 2nd by President Baxter. Motion carried 3-0.