107 W. Locust St. Courthouse

May 11, 2005

3:00 P.M.



The Warrick County Drainage Board met in regular session with Vice-President Phillip H. Baxter presiding, also in attendance were Don Williams, Secretary; James E. Niemeyer, Surveyor; David K. Zengler, Attorney for Board and Robert A. Wilson, Deputy Surveyor.


Commissioner Carl Conner was absent.


Minutes recorded by Cheryl D. Embry


Vice-President Phillip H. Baxter called the Warrick County Drainage Board meeting of May 11, 2005 to order.




Phil Baxter: The first order of business is the approval of minutes.


Don Williams: Mr. President, I move that we table the minutes for two weeks.


Phil Baxter: Have a motion to table, Iíll second, all in favor,Aye


Don Williams: Aye


Phil Baxter:Motion passes Two to zero. Ok we have bid openings on Bluegrass Creek.




David Zengler: I have been handed three bids and the first one I open is from DG Construction, Inc. Bid for Bluegrass Creek Logjam Removal, $2,700.00.

From Heck-Strahle Excavating bidding Bluegrass Creek Logjam $1,445.00

And from Warrick Excavating, Inc., bid on Bluegrass Creek Logjam removal is $2,200.00.


Don Williams: Were all three present at any kind of a pre-bid meeting or anything?


Robert Wilson: Yes


Don Williams: So all three of them were there, cause there is quite a bit of disparity, does the Surveyor feel comfortable with all three of the bidders as far as ability to perform their work?

Jim Niemeyer: I cannot attest to two of them or one of them because they are relatively new, not saying that they canít do the work, butÖÖ..


Phil Baxter: I know them.


Don Williams: Your satisfied.


Phil Baxter: Yes


Don Williams: In that case, Mr. President with your permission, I would move that we select Heck-Strahle for the sum of $1,445.00 for the Bluegrass Creek Logjam removal.


Phil Baxter: Iíll second that, All in favor


Don Williams: Aye


Phil Baxter: Aye. Motion passes. Ok, Jim






Jim Niemeyer: The next item on the list is for a Drainage Plan Approval for Eberle Farms Drainage plans, Robert.


Robert Wilson: Itís a 10 lot subdivision off of Bethany Church Road, all 2 Ĺ acres lots and they meet or exceed all of our drainage requirements so I recommend approval.


Don Williams: Ok, nothing below 2 Ĺ.


A gentleman from the audience spoke but was not picked up on the microphone.


Robert Wilson: He represents as Engineer.


Phil Baxter: Would you like to add anything, sir?


Don Williams: Have him state his name and address.


Bill Nicholson: Bill Nicholson, Mt. Vernon. I here representing as Engineer-Surveyor.


Don Williams: Do you have anything to add, Sir.


Bill Nicholson: No, I think the plans were pretty well self-explanatory and Iíve talked with the Engineerís Office and made changes that they ask for.


Don Williams: All lots are 2.5 or bigger?

Robert Wilson: Itís all in septic systems, right? You donít have any sewers, so itís all septic systems?


Bill Nicholson: Yes, 2 Ĺ acre lots, the soil tests were run by Newburgh, the Ralston and we have at lease one side on every lot and in some places two.


Don Williams: Mr. President, I move that we approve the drainage plans for Eberle Farms drainage.


Phil Baxter: Iíll second it, all those in favor state by saying aye.


Don Williams: Aye


Phil Baxter: Aye. Motion passes two to zero.


Bill Nicholson: Thank you.




Don Williams: Mr. President, on the Aerial Photographs, I would move that be tabled until the first meeting in June. Our attorney needs more time to research.


Phil Baxter: Okay


Don Williams: Does the Surveyor have any problem with that?


Robert Wilson: We just have one consultant looking to buy, but I donít think itís a major issue in their project. He didnít seem to be upset when he was told he had to wait the first time.


Don Williams: Okay, anyway thatís my motion, our attorney needs to check on something to make sure itís not copyrighted and that sort of thing.


Phil Baxter: I have a motion to table until the first meeting in June, Iíll second it, all in favor?


Don Williams: Aye


Phil Baxter: Aye. Motion carries two to zero.




Jim Niemeyer: The next item is the proposed Drainage Ordinance work to be done by Bernardin, Lochmueller & Associates. It has been submitted for signature and I donít have it back so I would say that you should table it until the next meeting.


Don Williams: I move that we table the Drainage Ordinance until two weeks from today.


Phil Baxter: Iíll second it, all in favor


Don Williams: Aye


Phil Baxter: Aye. Motion passes two to zero.




Jim Niemeyer: The next item is the Reburn complaint, there is an obstruction to drainage, Iíve seen it and so has my staff. I have turned Mr. Reburnís filed complaint and I submitted it to Mr. Zengler.


Don Williams: We need to set a date for a hearing then.


David Zengler: It needs to be set 30 days after his filing, soÖ..


Don Williams: When was it filed?


David Zengler: May 2, 2005


Don Williams: May 2nd, so the second Wednesday in June.


Secretary: June 14th


Don Williams: Thatís our first meeting in June? I move that we set a hearing on the complaint filed by Mr. Reburn for June the 14, 2005.


Phil Baxter: Iíll second that. All in favor.


Don Williams: Aye


Phil Baxter: Aye. Motion passes two to zero.




Jim Niemeyer: The next item concerns Bluegrass Creek area located near Elberfeld. The grinding has been completed and we, of course received the bids today to remove the log jams South of the ground area. The clearing is along the creek just North of the Seven Hills Road and it is progressing very well. So, within a week, give or take it should be completed in a week to do surveying there.


Don Williams: I was out there looking at it yesterday and so far its looking pretty good.


Jim Niemeyer: So the next thing weíre going to do is go ahead and shoot the bank-tops South of the new bridge along Seven Hills Road and prepare a final plans to straighten that stretch and we should be surveying that this week or early next with the new surveying instruments, which is adaptable to auto cad, so it ought to work pretty nice. This will be a first for us.


Don Williams: Thank you for your report.


Jim Niemeyer: Your welcome. The next item concerns Little Pigeon Creek.




Jim Niemeyer: We received a list from IDNR that the City of Boonville wishes to install a 24Ē diameter water pipe beneath the creek at a depth ofÖ.well, there will be 4-feet of cover and I presented that information to Mr. Zengler.


Phil Baxter: Where is the location of this?


Jim Niemeyer: I didnít bring that material, Dave, did you bring that material?


David Zengler: I may not have.


Don Williams: Who is making the request? The City of Boonville?


Jim Niemeyer: DNR sent this notice out for us to review because they are crossing a legal drain with a 24-inch water line. I didnít bring that up here, but the sustence of it is they want to place it 4-foot below the bottom of the ditch and my question is, one of them would be do we want to request that a Hold Harmless Agreement be filed by the City of Boonville?


Don Williams: Absolutely. Thatís standard procedure.


David Zengler: Okay, Iíll talk with the City.


Don Williams: I would think that if the City wants this done they ought to be making a request.


Jim Niemeyer: They did not.


Don Williams: Were they planning on just shooting it under there without saying anything.


Jim Niemeyer: I guess thatís why IDNR sends out these weekly notices and I caught it just as soon as it came in the office and I presented it to Mr. Zengler.


Don Williams: So, theyíre going 4-foot under the water line beneath the creek, theyíre talking from the bottom of the creek?

Jim Niemeyer: Yeah, below the base of the bed.


Don Williams: Says water line beneath the creek. Thatís standard depths, so as long as their willing to sign a Hold Harmless, I donít think it will be a problem, but somebody from the CityÖ..


Jim Niemeyer: We need to notify them.


Don Williams: Well, somebody from the City needs to come here and make the request.


Robert Wilson: Yeah, the Cityís Engineer probably.


Don Williams: I mean, right now DNR is saying they are wanting it, but there is nothing here for us to approve today, just a heads up.




Jim Niemeyer: The meeting with Spencer County concerns removal of four log-jams along Little Pigeon Creek and at the meeting it was decided that it should be investigated further and see what other obstacles there may be. We had discussions with Army Corps of Engineers because this drainage ditch is involved with U.S. waters of which Army Corps of Engineers has jurisdiction over and we were told that we need to file or submit an application to the U.S. Corps of Engineers to do this work. This is a two page application which I have nearly completed and it requires a signature of the Presidents of both Drainage Boards and a specification must be illustrated showing how we plan to do this work and it required all kinds location data and I would like to say its all finished. It is a difficult area but its nothing that we canít overcome, theyíre concerned that if weÖ..itís a wetland, itís a Little Pigeon Creek wetland and its owned by the State of Indiana.


Don Williams: If it keeps jamming up the creek, itíll be an even bigger wetland, I mean thatís probably what they want.


Jim Niemeyer: Thatís what they want, they told me we were going about it all wrong, but the best thing that we can do is lay the logs aside.


Don Williams: Take some more farmland.


Jim Niemeyer: Thatís just a report, weíll be ready to move on that fairly soon.


Phil Baxter: Good


Jim Niemeyer: And then once all the signatures are acquired, weíll submit it to the Corps of Engineers and then weíll go out in the field and proceed from there, hopefully get bids this summer.


Phil Baxter: Yeah, I hope so.



Secretary advised Drainage Board that she was erroneous on the date she gave them for the Reburn Hearing, the first meeting in June will be June 8, 2005.


Don Williams: That is the second Wednesday?


Secretary answered yes


Don Williams: We donít need to change the motion do we?


Phil Baxter: No.


David Zengler: Just reset the date.




Jim Niemeyer: The next item is MS-4 reporting progress, the class C report has been reviewed and Iíve returned it to Commonwealth Engineering to make the necessary changes, which they are reviewed and approved. We were asked to have the signatures from Mr. Williams and myself and it needs to be back in their office in Indianapolis so that they can file it with IDNR on May 20th and that is when it becomes effective. Then of course there will be meetings following setting it up and financing and so forth.




Phil Baxter: We have claims in the amount of $11,544.19. Any questions?


Don Williams: The only question I have is on items 2 & 3, Item 2 is just computer software. Item 3 is excavating, has that already been accomplished?


Robert Wilson: Yes, he completed it last week.


Don Williams: Mr. President I would move that we approve claims.


Phil Baxter: Iíll second it, all in favor?


Don Williams: Aye


Phil Baxter: Aye Motion Passes Two to zero.


Jim Niemeyer: Under other business, is there anyone here who is signed in?







Bill Bivins:††Bill Bivins, weíre here requesting a vacation of a Drainage Easement that will come before you on the Commissionerís Meeting next for a vacation. We have letters back from all the utilities.

Don Williams: Where is this at?


Bill Bivins:Its at Quail Crossing Subdivision, what happened these people built their pool over this Drainage Easement and weíre asking requesting that vacating the Public Utility 3-feet of the Drainage Easement.


Don Williams: Which Public Utility?


Bill Bivins: Its Public Utility Easements.


Don Williams: Is there anything under there?


Bill Bivins: No, I have letters from everybody stating that it is ok.


Don Williams:Theyíre what? Theyíre encroaching the 75-foot by 3-feet, is that what you are saying?


Bill Bivins: No, they are actually 13-feet over, there are two easements, one is a Public Utility and one is a drainage. Their over all the public utility but the public utilities are all back in the Drainage Easement and off the property, so none of the utilities are affected.


Sherri Phillips: It is not a Legal Drain, it is simply a Drainage Easement thatís been platted in the subdivision and what we need from the Drainage Board is normallyÖÖ


Don Williams: Is this what you were referring to earlier about a change in drainage plans?


Sherri Phillips: Iím going to bring this up to Attorney Zengler, the question I have kind of goes along with it, I know that at a previous meeting that you discussed the role of the Drainage Board and over recorded Drainage Easements. My question is and I guess Iím trying to get an understanding because this Board, the Drainage Board approves the Drainage Plans for any subdivision, they approve where the drainage plans go, whether there are swales, anything to do with drainage plans, if you change those drainage plans, you come back before this Board to amend those plans in some cases. I have sent Mr. Bivins and them to this Board for the fact, just to make sure that vacating this Drainage Easement will not affect the approved Drainage Plans that was done by this Board. I think thatÖÖit was always my understanding that this Drainage Board had a say in whether that Drainage Easement in the Surveyors Office, the Surveyor whether that is required or not whether to vacate it or not. The Commissionerís as the Commissioners would have no idea, the Drainage Board would. We have other matters that which, if it wasnít the same peopleÖ we have other items such as parking lots going into Drainage Easements where we would want the Drainage Board and the Surveyor to say whether that would affect those approve Drainage Plans or not. That is why we had them come to you a few weeks ago about parking lots in the Drainage Easements. We changed our Zoning Ordinance to require improvements location permits for fences going across on lots because they were putting fences across Drainage Easements and backing up the water on adjacent property owners. So if anyone would want a permit for a fence in the Drainage Easement, I would have them come to the Drainage Board to make sure that it wouldnít affect the drainage plans before we would grant the variance to put the fence up. So, if Iím wrong about this I want to beÖÖ..


Don Williams: Dead wrong.


Sherri Phillips:I want a ruling, because I mean itís the Drainage Boardís role to approve the location of the drainage easements in a subdivision.


Don Williams: The Drainage Plans certainly is, modification of it, I donít think has ever come before us.


Sherri Phillips:In the past the Surveyor sometimes would go, well, I donít think it will affect the drainage plan, but I would rather and I donít know if Jim would, the Drainage Board get the plan and determine if it would affect the drainage or not and make a ruling on it if that is by law can be done.


David Zengler: I think its up to the Board, if they want it.


Don Williams: Well, this is just, which way is the water flowing North or South?


Bill Bivins:This is right on top of a hill, there is no water there, justÖ.


Don Williams: Itís a Drainage Easement on top of the hill?


Bill Bivins: Yes, thatís common, you put the drainage easements on the back of all the lots.


Don Williams: Not that their going to drain in that direction, anyway. Thatís one thing I have learned in four years, Mr. Bivins, that water does run downhill (laughter).


Phil Baxter: I donít see any problem with it.


Don Williams: I donít either, I donít see any problem with it.


Sherri Phillips: Okay and do I haveÖI mean, do you think that this BoardÖ..


Don Williams: What are you looking at from us?


Sherri Phillips: Just aÖ..I would like a motion that it will not affect the approved drainage plan by vacating this easement.


Don Williams: I donít see any problem with that, its on top of a hill, its not a problem. Mr. President, do you have a problem with that?


Phil Baxter: No, make a motion.


Don Williams: I would move thatÖÖ.what are you looking forÖ.. thatÖÖIím trying to figure out how this needs to be worded. Are you talking about an easement?


Phil Baxter: Is it a Drainage Easement or a DrainageÖÖÖ.


Sherri Phillips: Well, it would be just that the Drainage Board has no objection to vacating an easement in an approved drainage plan, hows that?


Robert Wilson: Are we vacating all of it or 3-feet of it?


Sherri Phillips:No, 3-feet of it, I think.


Robert Wilson: So, weíre not even vacating the whole thing just 3-feet of it. So we still have a Drainage Easement on it then.


Don Williams: This is very unusual to act on something I havenít really had a chance to look at, but this is really straight forward, so I would move that we grant you request to vacate that drainage, that 3-feet of drainage easement there in Quail Crossing Lot 62.


Phil Baxter: Iíll second it, all in favor, Aye


Don Williams: Aye


Phil Baxter: Passes, two to zero.


Bill Bivins: Thank you.


Phil Baxter: Anyone else


Jim Niemeyer: I have no other business.


Don Williams: Mr. President, I move we adjourn.


Phil Baxter: Iíll second it.