COMMISSIONERS MEETING ROOM
November 22, 2006
Boonville, In 47601
The Warrick County Drainage Board met in regular session with President Don Williams presiding, also in attendance were Phillip H. Baxter, Vice-President; Carl Jay Conner, Secretary; David K. Zengler, Attorney and Sean M. Owen, Deputy Surveyor.
Minutes were recorded and transcribed by Cheryl D. Embry.
Also in Attendance:† Manny Rydholm.
APPROVAL OF MINUTES: †
Cheryl:† One was sick and one was not at the previous meeting.
Don Williams:† Okay, that is what I was thinking because Phil needed to be here to approve the 25th, if I remember right.
Carl Conner: youíre right.
Don Williams:† Okay, letís take them separately, entertain a motion to approve the October 25, 2006 minutes.
Carl Conner:† So moved
Phil Baxter:† Second
Motion was made and seconded, all voted aye. Motion carried 3-0.
Don Williams:† November 8, 2006. It was you and I, I believe, Carl?
Carl Conner: Yes, I approve as presented.
Don Williams:† Have a motion to approve as presented, Iíll second that motion.
Motion was carried with 2 aye votes and one abstention from Mr. Baxter.
BID OPENING-TANGLEWOOD DITCH & GARDNER-WEBB DITCH:
Don Williams:† We have bid opening on Gardner-Webb Ditch
David Zengler: I have two quotes, one from Jerry Aigner Construction, Inc quote for Tanglewood and Gardner-Webb Ditches. They are showing Tanglewood and Gardner-Webb Ditches parts A, B & C base bid $34,500.00 and then they have listed unit costs of seeding $500.00 lump sum and install erosion control blankets. Blankets and staples provided by Surveyor $40.00 a blanket.
Don Williams:† How many blankets?
David Zengler:† It doesnít say.
Phil Baxter: Sean, when you send out bid requests what is the amount of time you normally give?
Sean Owen: There will be approximately a week to two weeks where they will come to a pre-bid meeting and then after that pre-bid meeting then there would be another week and a half to two weeks before the next drainage board meeting.
David Zengler:† Bid for Tanglewood and Gardner-Webb Ditches by Bigge Excavating, They are showing a base bid for parts A & B and item 2 which is seeding ditch slopes and banks, they are showing a total of $23, 606.00.
Don Williams:† Thatís just for A & B? What was the rest of the bid?
David Zengler: Part C would be grinding brush and cleaning 1440 feet of Gardner-Webb Ditch cost per foot is $1.50 per foot, total $2,160.00.
Don Williams:† Thatís in addition?
David Zengler:† I would say thatís in addition, so that would cover parts A.B. & C and the item 2 is the seeding of ditch slopes and banks for $300.00. So that total would be $23,606.00 plus $2,160.00 whatever that is.
Sean Owen:† $25, 766.00
Carl Conner:† Plus the $300.00.
Don Williams:† I got a total of $26066.00 if I added right. Youíve got $23,606.00 plus $2,160.00 and the $300.00.
David Zengler: No, the $300.00 is part of the $23,606.00.
Don Williams: So then it would be $25,766.00.
David Zengler: This bid also includes installing the erosion control blanket provided by Surveyorís Office, cost per square yard $.50 total amountÖ.
Carl Conner:† Do you know what the square footage is per blanket?
Sean Owen: They are 7-foot wide by 100-foot long.
Phil Baxter: 700-feet?
Carl Conner:† Thatís $350.00 is it not? Per blanket, thatís not right. Well, thatís $35.00 compared to $40.00 per blanket, thatís a $5.00 savings plus the total projects excluding the blankets is $25, 766.00 compared to $35,000.00, soÖ..
Don Williams:† Itís a big difference and they were both at the same pre-bid meeting.
Sean Owen:† I wasnít there but Jim said they were both present.
Don Williams:† Okay, do either of you gentleman have any questions, if notÖ.
Phil Baxter:† The only question I have is that we really donít know what the cost is, do we?
Don Williams:† Well, we donít know the total cost because we donít know what the blankets are, but thatís the only thing.
Sean Owen: This would be the total cost for the labor and then we donít know exactly how many blankets weíre going to need.
Don Williams:†† But we know one blanket from Bigge are $5.00 less than the blankets from Aigners since they are 7-feet by 100-feet each, we can assume thatÖ..
Phil Baxter:† Maybe IÖ.is the labor to install the blanket included in this?
Don Williams:† Yes
Phil Baxter:† It is, oh ok
Carl Conner: They are just bidding on the labor.
Sean Owen:† Yes, and then we provide the blankets.
Phil Baxter:† Well, when they said $.50 per square foot I didnít knowÖ.
Carl Conner:† Per square yard.
Phil Baxter: Per square yard, yes Okay itís less than 700 then Okay.
David Zengler: Maybe I said that wrong, this is for square yard.
Don Williams:† Good, everybody is on the same page.
Phil Baxter: Iím in the program now, sorry.
Don Williams:† Thatís what weíre here about to get everybody on the same page. Do either of you gentleman have any questions? Anything the surveying office would like to add? Okay I would entertain a motion for the project of bids for Tanglewood and Gardner-Webb Ditches.
Carl Conner:† I would move that we award the bid for the work on Tanglewood and Gardner to Bigge Excavation.
Phil Baxter:† Second
The motion was made and voted on to award the bid to Bigge Excavating. All members voted aye. Motion passed 3-0.
Don Williams:† The next item is Wren Lake Subdivision and I understand that has been requested to be tabled until the first meeting in December.
Sean Owen:† Yes sir, we received a letter from the attorney representing Mr. and Mrs. Murphy, they have just been hired and they received a letter from the Area Plan Commission about the things that they need before they can come back to the meetings and they need the time to review it. So they have requested that they be put on the meeting for December 13, 2006.
Don Williams:† Okay, I move that we table that until December 13, 2006.
Carl Conner: Second.
Motion was made and seconded all members voted aye. Motion passed 3-0.
GREEN SPRINGS VALLEY-DISCUSSION:
Don Williams:† Discussion
Manny Rydholm:† Iím
Manny Rydholm from
Don Williams:† Would you like an update before you begin? Our surveyor is not here but I† believe our assistant can brief you on the update to this point.
Sean Owen: Jim has been in contact with Ped-Corp for the apartments numerous times this week they are currently working on getting some type of letter and stating some of the problems they see and what needs to be fixed. They are waiting to talk to Bobby Howard the Highway Engineer, he was on vacation this week to they werenít able to talk to him. They expect to have that letter to us quickly and also Schnucks, we have been in contact with the property manager and the Schnucks Company manager and they have cleaned out a large portion of that ditch. Jim has inspected it and said that it is flowing well and he has talked to them about the possibility of make that a regulated drain and they said that they will do anything they can to help the situation.
Manny Rydholm: I knew that Schnucks had cleaned it out and I knew that they had done a better job this time than in the past. Do you know if any contact has been made, we talked about working with Ped-Corp in trying to get the drainage issues, some of the problems they have created in the deviations that may be there and what they built, I believe, I understand. Has there also been discussion with them about their task of cleaning, I know there is still some discussion of making it legal but of cleaning that out. At one point we talked about giving them notification and if they didnít take some action in so many days we can go in and clean it and charge them. Was that not mentioned in an earlier meeting?
Sean Owen: I think we did talk about it. I donít know how far weíve researched that.
Don Williams:†† If it is an impediment of a natural waterway, then we can takeÖ..we have certain steps we can go through to do that type of a thing. From the last meeting and you might correct me if Iím wrong, but the conclusion was made that when Ped-Corp put in their pipes they put them in undersized because they did not consider the full area of where the water was coming from. They put in 12 or 15-inch pipes as I recall and Jim was saying it probably would take 18 to 24 inch pipes and I think I made a response that why donít we put in 30-inch and be done with it to make sure we have enough to cover the drainage. Because that is a concern and we are going to continue to pursue this, but you are more than welcome to come to the meetings but we are going to see this through.
Manny Rydholm: you mentioned that they are coming back, they are putting together a response to what they propose to do if I understand and we would expect, I mean it doesnít sound like we have a real defined deadline for that but we expect that in the next couple of weeks?
Sean Owen: I think it will be within the next couple of weeks, but Iím not sure exactly what they are wanting to talk about with Mr. Howard.
Don Williams:† I hope you have a positive Christmas present from those folks.
Manny Rydholm:† There was a thought by some that some action would already be taken, but I think the comment was made that it could be taken possibly toÖ..
Don Williams:† If they sat there and throw their backs up and say weíre not going to do anything then the County could step in, Itís not a legal drain so we have to actually have a hearing, we have to have a finding and I know this much for sure and our attorney has to actually have a finding and an investigation that they are indeed impeding a natural drain and then we have toÖ..it takes time to, we have to write a letter to direct him to take care of the problem and then if they donít take care of the problem in a certain length of time and to be real honest with you, if they will work with us it will be much quicker than to have to go through that whole process. But that certainly will be done if they are not cooperative.
Manny Rydholm: The other question I have is there is one other party involved here is the east side of that ditch going opposite the apartments, has any contact been made there to your knowledge?
Sean Owen: I believe he has contacted them, but I donít know how far heís gotten with them.
Don Williams:† What was the name of those apartments?
Sean Owen:† Wyntree Villas, theyíre condos.
Manny Rydholm:† While weíre talking about ditches a little bit, Edwards has come up before and it is critical to clean that and as I recall the comments were made that it was going to be put together in a bigger package of cleaning ditches to be address and what not, is that correct, do you know if that is being done?
Don Williams:†† We
have a study that is being done that is being done right now about the whole,
really weíre talking about County drainage, but the emphasis is
Manny Rydholm: Do we have any kind of target dates as to when the study is going to be done?
Don Williams:† That I canít tell you, but if Roger was here or Jim because we did talk to Wessener & Associates because they are the people who are looking at that, at the County wide one and I donít know Iíd be afraid to guess a date. But we do know that it is underway.
Manny Rydholm: But weíre waiting on the completion of that to see how it fits and before anything is going to happen on the cleaning of the Edwards Ditch or can that possibly be addressed prior to doing that, I mean that is something that needs to be cleaned out severely.
Sean Owen: I think that is one of our next projects was to see what we need to do to try to figure out which is the best one to clean first, be it Pigeon Creek, Edwards or Weinsheimer. All three of those need it and either one of those should improve drainage throughout that entire area, we just havenít decided which one we want to attack first.
Manny Rydholm: Are funds available to do those, I mean is that an issue?
Sean Owen:† We will have funds as of January.
Manny Rydholm:† Iíll ask Jim this question, too, one of the things that we talked about was following up on the First Christian Church on checking that as a lot of water is coming across the street and seeing if that was done the way it was supposed to be done from a drainage standpoint.
Don Williams:† I
know there is a question concerning that lot there on the corner of
Manny Rydholm: But there was also in talking the last time to Jim was he talked about having an Engineer or somebody going up there and checking out the drainage there, but that is how I remember it anyway.
Don Williams:† I do recall that and I donít know if thatís happened or not.
Sean Owen: Iím not sure, I know weíve went up there and they do have a large retention basin, but Iím not sure.
Manny Rydholm:† The front of that is just pretty well just paving and what not.
David Zengler: There is a second retention pond there in the front.
Manny Rydholm: Itís very small, like an oversized drainage ditch, but there is some but it looks kind of minimal and that may be the way it was approved.
Don Williams:† That might need to be what is put in there at that corner of Lincoln and 261 is a nice little tract that drains right there, instead of a business or anything else.
Manny Rydholm: A couple of more questions, at our last neighborhood meeting there were comments about the streets being resurfaced a number of years ago and it contributing to some of the problems, the curbs in that neighborhood are really small. There is not much curb there and the paving that was done actually took some drainage away from the streets and some people have problems with water running over the curbs into their drives and into their garages. A question came up as to whether there were any suggestions to what we can do about that?
Don Williams:† Any particular intersections or areas?
Manny Rydholm:† I would have to get more involved, but I know of one area where that is happening but we will dig into it and present it with better pictures of where we have the issues.
Don Williams:† Mr. Rydholm, that particular issue probably would be better served at a Commissioners Meeting, where our Highway Engineer and Highway Superintendent is there because if there is a resurfacing problem which has caused an issue and if we can get specific areas then that is the department that needs to look at it not this Board. The roadside ditches are the Highway Department.
Manny Rydholm:† The next thing may be for them too if we can do a better job of paying attention where we have some issues and maybe somebody can come and look at it.
Don Williams:† If you have a drainage issue and call out there and contact Mr. Roach who is our superintendent, he is a man who will give you his ear and do what he can to take care of the problem.
Carl Conner: If I can make a suggestion, what I would suggest is that you get specific information together for example like Don said, what intersections, certain sections of the street and bring that information to the County Commissioners Meeting on December 20, 2006 at 4:00 P.M. in this room.
Don Williams:† And if you call this office at 897-6120 and get ahold of Roger or Susie either one and tell them that you would like to be placed on the agenda for that issue as a result of this meeting.
Carl Conner: We can follow up on the issue then much better that way and go from there, so if you could be here on the 20th.
Manny Rydholm:† Ok, that will give us some time to look into that with the Holidays going on and so forth.
Don Williams:† Yes, kind of get a punch list for us.
Manny Rydholm: This other thing would fit with that too where the water continues after a long time after things dry up, water seeping out from underneath the roads we can identify some of those things at the same time.
Don Williams:† We would be particularly interested in that if we have roads that are being undermined,
Mr. Rydhold thanked the Board and Board members thanked him and wished him Happy Holidays.
Don Williams:† Is there any other business to come before this Board? Sean, do you have anything?
BOND ISSUE DISCUSSION: †
Sean Owen: We have received an update from BLA on the drainage study for the Ivy Glenn, Mansfield and Fall Creek area, they have done about 90% of the date collection and now they are working on the hydraulic model on how all the ponds work together and coming up with some remedies of that situation and they estimate by December 15, 2006 they will submit a preliminary report for the Board and receive comments and then they will go back and get the final on it.
Carl Conner: That sounds good, that is a major area of issues over there and its more than one issue.
Don Williams:† Commissioner Conner, do you have anything, Commissioner Baxter? Mr. Zengler? (they answered they did not) I have one thing and it is really just to mention as I was talking to Sean earlier. In looking at weíve been talking about putting in and extending the legal drain of Howard-Williams Ditch down to the river according to the think map we did a rough measurement and weíre talking right at 1.4 miles and the biggest obstacle that we saw was the interstate highway, putting the pipe under that, getting the Highway Department to, but it looks like a fairly straight path and for the most part unpopulated as far as buildings in the way. So if weíre going to do that we need to keep that on the burner and get that done as soon as we can.
Carl Conner:† What kind of cost are we looking at?
Don Williams:†† Weíre looking at having a bond issue.
Carl Conner: So that would be a part of the comprehensiveÖ.yeah okay.
Don Williams:† Weíre
looking at 4-5 million thatís reversing the flow of Howard-Williams Ditch. The
sooner we do that all those down there in
Carl Conner:† When are we going to have this comprehensive plan completed?
Don Williams:† I donít know, we need to talk to Wessler becauseÖÖno, itís not Wessler its Commonwealth doing that as part of the MS4.
Sean Owen: The storm water master plan.
Carl Conner:† Arenít we going to have to have a plan in place and approved and priced out before we can go do a bond issue for purposes of doing any work?
David Zengler: Yes the study has to be completed and the price determined as the gal fromÖ.says, the bond issue would take 4-5 months to do, but you have to have how much and what youíre going to do.
Carl Conner: I guess the first step to Donís project is we have to get the plan completed and do we have any idea when the plans going to be done?
Don Williams:† The comprehensive plan I donít know if it has to be necessarily completed, what we have to do though is certainly have a plan for reversing the direction of the flow of that ditch to the river and the cost of doing that. I mean, it doesnít have to be ÖÖ.
Carl Conner: Right, but isnít that a part of the comprehensive plan or not?
Don Williams:† It should be the whole thing. Now that actual thing we need to talk about, I think the last time we talked to Don Larson and we specifically mentioned that if I remember correctly.
Carl Conner:† Why donít we just speculate, so are we talking 2 months before this comprehensive plans going to be done orÖÖÖÖÖ
Don Williams:† I donít think we know I think we need to ask them.
Carl Conner:† So, who is heading that up the Surveyors Office?
Don Williams:† Actually Surveyors Office, its coming under MS4 so Jim and I are working with theÖ.
Carl Conner:† So youíll tell us when the plansÖ.
Don Williams:†† I believe it was the last of September so it hasnít been too long.
Carl Conner: So it they get it done the first part of next year and it has to be turned over to I assume several contractors to get bids or at least some reasonable prices and weíre talking how long before we can get a bond issue?
David Zengler:† I think she said about 3-4 months.
Don Williams:† It can happen quicker if you line up your turkeys and do it.
Carl Conner:† So weíre probably looking at least June.
Don Williams:† Thatís why I brought it up because we need to keep this on our mind cause I think this board and I assume Phil also thinks it needs to be done.
There was other discussion on how long it might take and
what procedures the Board would have to go through along with the County
Council approvals. It was discussed that they are aware of the flooding issues
and problems in
Phil Baxter: I make a motion to adjourn.
Carl Conner: Second
Motion was made and seconded with all members voting aye. Motion carried 3-0.